Why is some of my cheap vinyl quieter than audiophile vinyl?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Jamie Tate, Mar 16, 2006.

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  1. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Nashville
    I was playing some newly opened Classic Records pressings of several Genesis albums (180 and 200 gram). I cleaned each record before I played it and was shocked at how noisy they were. Lots of pop and ticks throughout and I could hear the surface noise through the music.

    Then I play a Cars Greatest Hits LP that actually had mud on it that I bought for $1. The muddy Cars LP was SILENT!!! I don't mean it was just quiet, I mean not one pop or tick and the surface noise could only be heard if you turn the volume way up between songs. After the Cars I played an old DOT LP and same thing. Dead silent vinyl.

    What's happening here?
     
  2. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Maybe has something to do with static? My new 180-gram LP's seem to be a lot more prone to static than my older albums.

    Strangely enough, I find that albums that I played more, sound better. I have an old copy of Rush's Carress of Steel, and side one, which I played a lot, has little noise. Side two, which I know I never played but once, is a clean, glossy looking, unlistenable piece of crap. Maybe our audiophile albums will all sound better in a few years, no? ;)
     
  3. Stax Fan

    Stax Fan Forum Resident

    Location:
    Midwest
    Because some audiophile vinyl is overrated and a lot of regular vinyl is underrated. :)

    Stylus profile can have a big effect on this. Line contact types are generally quieter in the groove with elipticals having little in the way of forgiveness in this respect. They turn the tables with regard to VTA sensitivity, though (more forgiving of VTA). Classic Records pressings are a bigger pain in 200g form as is now pretty common knowledge, but you evidently lucked out and got some funky 180g copies. :D I feel your pain.

    CDs have their charms. :)
     
  4. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    South Plymouth, Ma
    I personally think they're skipping some step in plating like cleaning the mother.

    Most every or every other Classic Records pressing, especially 200g ones, just don't come out just right. It's very difficult to get a 180g record perfect, quiet. A 200g is going to take more cooling time? Yes?

    Just a few ideas. Go get a Fantasy OJC LP for $10, even one of those Rainbo-made Blue Note LPs for $10 (reissues) and they beat most Classic Records reissues.

    I think they've just gone hog-wild with the "fairy dust" not caring how its effected QC.
     
  5. joelee

    joelee Hyperactive!

    Location:
    Houston
    I couldn't have said it better.
     
  6. Todd Fredericks

    Todd Fredericks Senior Member

    Location:
    A New Yorker
    I agree 100%. I've noticed that for the last several years that "audiophile" vinyl has not been as quiet as one would hope for. It's really a major pity because of the price and most importantly because behind the noise there's some fine music happening. If only the old magic JVC "see through" vinyl was an option in today's world. Imagine the bliss.....

    Todd
     
  7. Jeff H.

    Jeff H. Senior Member

    Location:
    Northern, OR

    I've noticed the same thing. I had a Classic Records copy of Carole Kings' "Tapestry" that wasn't exactly a quiet pressing. I sold it and got the Ode/Epic pressing, and that one is dead quiet. Also warmer sounding than the Audiophile LP.

    I have a copy of The Cars Greatest Hits album and it does sound really good. WEA has used Specialty Records Corporation to press their vinyl for a number of years. The grade of vinyl they use and quality of the pressings are usually excellent. Test pressings, promos and stock copies that I have pressed there reflect the same high standard.
     
  8. Rachael Bee

    Rachael Bee Miembra muy loca

    Skinny records consistently beat fat records in my experience. I'm gun-shy about all so-called audiophile vinyl, the fat stuff. Skinny is always my first choice. I think fat is just a gimmick to add cost.
     
  9. Evan L

    Evan L Beatologist

    Location:
    Vermont
    I agree, I've had mostly nothing but problems with "fat" vinyl, either with the tracking, or noise and/or skipping. Blech.


    Evan :mad:
     
  10. Plinko

    Plinko Senior Member

    No, they do not beat tube cut Classic Records reissues. If this isn't the general consensus, then I would be completely shocked.

    Nothing wrong with OJCs however...in spite of the fact that they are digital. I have numerous but they simply don't compare to the Classic Blue Notes I have. Blue Note reissues pale in comparison as well.

    Only issue I have had with Classic Records is a couple weren't perfectly flat and I couldn't hear sound degradation so my lazy **** kept them. I now have around 20 of them.

    Do I appreciate RTI? Not really. Yes, maybe. Had problems with other labels. With over 50 titles from RTI and with about 8 of those having "issues" (mostly warps), I think they need to improve. But, at the same time, I do not want them to go away. A lot of the RTI vinyl is some of the best sounding vinyl I own.
     
  11. Todd Fredericks

    Todd Fredericks Senior Member

    Location:
    A New Yorker
    Some of them are digital and some are incredible analog (which are a treat). :)
     
  12. Plinko

    Plinko Senior Member

    I have some older OJCs that are analog besides the digital so, yes. I thought the newer ones are digital. I have some OJCs that I have bought for $3 to $5 where I cannot believe how good the soundstage is. All of them however, sound "thin" compared to my audiophile vinyl. Perhaps it's a VTA thing but I do have fat sounding thin vinyl. Either way, my reality is that adjusting VTA on the fly is not an option with my table.

    It's the OBC's that I really want but I never find them.

    Earlier, I was hoping Mr. Hoffman would come in and say they are doing Analogue Productions of Prestige Bluesville titles (aside from the few they have already done - Lightnin' Hopkins, Willie Dixon, etc...).
     
  13. JWB

    JWB New Member

    I lucked out with The Who's 200g LP's on Classic Records. All mine have been perfect.
     
  14. peter

    peter Senior Member

    Location:
    Paradise
    Mistake
     
  15. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    I played my very-seldom-played 1980 Columbia pressing of Barbra Streisand's "Guilty" last night, and it was remarkably clean.
     
  16. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    South Plymouth, Ma
    RTI does almost 35% of all vinyl in the market today? Something like that?

    Take a 180g AA pressing and get any 180g "Quiex", knowing Rick's buds are doing basically the same thing for both pieces of wax.

    Why does a Classic Records LP sound so noisy? Not only the fact some are just OVERMODULATED, which is another thing all together.

    Yet, I bought a copy of Cliff Craft (Clifford Jordan, Blue Note) and Warne Marsh's Atlantic S/T LP - both done at Rainbo, CA - both of these $10 LPs and they sound freaking fantastic? :long face and shrug:

    What's up with that? No clue.
     
  17. dkmonroe

    dkmonroe A completely self-taught idiot

    Location:
    Atlanta
    I must say that I have at least one remarkably quiet 180 gram LP - an Earkmark DMM copy of Black Sabbath Volume 4. I bought it about a week ago, and when I first played it, I thought I'd accidentally unplugged my preamp until the music started. That darn thing is so quiet I didn't even hear the needle meet the vinyl. MUCH quieter than my non-DMM Earmark label Master of Reality.
     
  18. Jamie Tate

    Jamie Tate New Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Nashville
    The whole Whiter Shade Of Pale single really pissed me off. Now these Genesis LPs are making me even more upset. I haven't played the Zeppelin stuff yet. I'm kind of scared to knowing how much money I've already spent on these things.
     
  19. t3hSheepdog

    t3hSheepdog Forum Artist

    Location:
    lazor country
    often times it's hit or miss
    I like to check deadwax info in the forum before I go looking for a specific record
     
  20. 51nocaster

    51nocaster Senior Member

    I certainly can't agree with this. I almost always find Classic's Blue Note mono series to sound better than most any of the OJC Fantasy series or Rainbo Blue Notes. And almost every one I have gotten has been dead quiet and flat as well. Rarely have I seen quality control issues. Some of the classic rock titles--Zeppelin, Neil Young, etc , I have bought have had some of the issues mentioned. Luckily, I buy at a shop where the owner will not tolerate noisy vinyl and has a very liberal return policy. He sends all of the noisy vinyl back no questions asked.
     
  21. Sckott

    Sckott Hand Tighten Only.

    Location:
    South Plymouth, Ma
    You're really a lucky doode, then....
     
  22. Jeff H.

    Jeff H. Senior Member

    Location:
    Northern, OR
    I bought a used copy of that on vinyl a while back. It does sound very good. I've found the quality of most stock CBS vinyl LP's to be consistantly good. They didn't really begin to take a nosedive until after they were taken over by Sony. The quality started to drop way off in the late 80's.
     
  23. John

    John Senior Member

    Location:
    Northeast
    The Classic 200g vinyl is really frustrating. Its rare that I get a quiet one. Ive really cut down on the number of audiophile pressings that I buy because of noisy vinyl, but Classic is the worst offender. I will admit they have improved, but there is still room for improvement. For comparison sake my older Classic 180g LPs are quiet.

    Also, didnt the MOFI Anadisc series use 200g vinyl? I do not own too many of these but the ones I do have are quiet. Not JVC quiet, but very good. Also, wasnt the UHQR series >200g? I seem to recall an old MOFI poop sheet that said they were somewhere around 220g IIRC, I do not remember ever hearing that they had noise problems, so one would think that 200g shouldnt be a problem. Hmmmm.

    There is some really great mastering going on nowadays, its sad that vinyl quality cannot go hand in hand.

    With regard to RTI, Im lost! They used to put out consistently quiet vinyl, quite possibly the best, now its very spotty. With other plants having closed down, are they over capacity?
     
  24. Macman

    Macman Senior Member

    I must be lucky. I have several Classics, as well as a bunch of MSFL, and they're all dead quiet. It's other new vinyl that I'm having trouble with. I will never buy another Lost Highways release on vinyl after buying Ryan Adams' Jacksonsville City Nights, or whatever it's called. It might be the noisiest pressing I've ever heard and I've found varying degrees of noise on everything I've bought except Wilco's A Ghost is Born, which is wonderful. I'm at the point of refusing to buy any new vinyl EXCEPT Classic and MFSL.
     
  25. Jeff H.

    Jeff H. Senior Member

    Location:
    Northern, OR
    Yes they did. Some people complained of the pressings being noisy. The inner jacket of those releases state that MOFI didn't de-horn the metal parts before manufacturing the discs, to avoid the loss of transient sonics. They claimed that playing the discs would eventually get rid of any minor clicks and pops heard on the initial play. I've owned a handful of these albums including "Boston", Bob Marleys' "Exodus", U2 "Unforgettable Fire", and Count Basies' "April In Paris" and none of them were overly noisy at all.
     
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