Installing a Dynavector 10x5 on a P3...What do I need?

Hi Anthony, I guess the tracking force is as accurate as the Shure gauge is. Not sure how accurate it goes to.

Yes, the cartridge is much lower than my Rega was. It sounds good though, so I will just have to be careful when lowering the tonearm. Without individual adjustment to VTA for thicker records, they will sound different. With the VTAF, you will be able to adjust for those and they should sound great.

 

There's a very small hex setscrew that holds the lift mechanism assembly in position. You can loosen it -- but don't remove it -- and move the whole unit upwards. The stylus should clear the record by at least 3/16" with the lift mechanism up.

 

Wow. Thanks for the tip. I will try that as soon as I get home tonight.

 

No problem. You might might want to look at the 4mm spacer with the Rega nut extender. I had the 20XH on my RB-600 and the 2mm wasn't enough. I don't know if the 10x5 is the same height but you might want to do a comparison.

 

I was wondering what the Shure gauge read with the tracking force set to 2.2 on the arm. In other words, was the arm setting accurate according to the Shure gauge?

Anthony

 

You are welcome Ian. When I first used that protractor, I too had an issue with not enough light. I have tried different weights and decided 2.2g is what I preferred as well. The Dynavector sounds pretty decent right out of the box, but give it 50 hours or so and you'll be in audio Nirvana. Enjoy!

 

I had to make a small adjustment. (But it seems like all the adjustments are small, so I guess that is a relative term.)

Listening to Miles Davis' Tribute to Jack Johnson right now. I'm really enjoying McLaughlin's guitar work on this one.

 

A Wally Tractor works well. I've set up oodles of 10x5 and P3. Best combo going!

 

I still find that last track useful, to help you get the distortion (at least close to) equal between the channels. Use headphones. Vary the volume (I can usually tell better at low levels). Then make any tiny tweaks over time with music if necessary.

I'd consider a proper VTA height accessory of some sort, in place of a washer. I use the Expressimo one because it doesn't require alteration of the original mounting hole. If it were a removable armboard, I might consider the others, but with a Rega where the arm mounts through the plinth, I didn't want to permanently alter and possibly damage it from modification of the original hole.

 

Steve, here are some photos:

 

Thanks for posting the pictures Ian. Looks like you made a good choice.

 

No problem!

I do think I made a good choice. The cartrige is logging the hours as I get it broken in. I have no idea how many are on it, but its a bunch. It definitely opened up some more, especially in the highs. I expect it will continue to do so from what I have read. Right now it sounds fantastic though.

I just finished listening to the first Dire Straits album, and it is basically a different experience from listening to it with the Elys. That huge warm bass all through the album never sounded close to this with the Elys. The lower surface noise really showcases the guitar work in Six Blade Knife and a few others. The really quiet stuff. It sounds just lovely now.

I'm off to play Love Over Gold now!

 

Some comments

Hi - congratulations! You have an awesome, killer combination of table and cart. And, you have provided a very helpful how-to post, for people who will mount their own carts.

I am a Rega and Dynavector "nut" and have fiddled with my P25 and various Dyna carts verrrrrrry extensively. Here are some thoughts that should further improve the sound of your records with your excellent pair of components.

If you don't like advice of this sort, you can just ignore this, and still have great sounding music -- this will just help a bit more, like turning a guitar amp up to "11." OK in no order of importance:

1. Set the tracking force between 1.9g and 2.0g, wherever your ear tells you is best. Heavier than 2.0g will smush some of the sparkle out of your music.

2. Put antiskate at 1/3 of the possible distance that the slider can go.

3. Do not over-tighten the headshell screws or the big nut under the tonearm. They should be merely "snug," meaning only a tiny bit tighter than finger-tight. Over tightening results in compressed-sounding bass and lower mids.

4. Give your P3's platter a head-start spin before you turn it on, in order to put less strain on the motor over time.

5. Use a level (on the platter itself) to ensure that your P3 is, well, level.

6. Give your 10x5 at least 40 hours of play before you seriously evaluate its sound quality.

7. Break in the cart with real music (rather than by dropping it into a continuous groove on a setup record).

8. Don't use Stevenson alignment. Instead, use Baerwald with this protractor: http://mkjnovak.homestead.com/files/align.PDF

If you are crazy, like me, attach another small piece of paper so that you can extend the longer line of the protractor with a ruler. This allows that line to exactly touch the pivot point of your tonearm.

Baerwald provides overall less distortion than Stevenson and results in slightly deeper, cleaner sound.

9. To improve the sound of your 10x5, denude it. This means removing the red plastic body, which is attached with small screws. I have seen pros do this, but have not done it myself, so I'm not sure how difficult it is to do. My sense is that it's not a big deal. Easily a 20% improvement in sound quality, maybe more. Yes, that much. For me, mandatory.

10. Use RRL stylus cleaner. It's the only one I've tried that has ever resulted in a noticeable improvement in the sound quality of my stereo.

11. *Never* clean the stylus with the tonearm locked in place. You never want to put more pressure on that stylus than is exerted by the weight of the tonearm itself.

12. Make sure that your P3's glass platter is on "right side up." Usually, one side is better than the other. I.e., one side will make the platter turn symmetrically, the other side will cause some back-and-forth movement horizontally (as if the hole were not exactly in the middle of the platter). To check this, take the mat off your platter. Find a piece of paper with an intricate design on it, and place it under the edge of the platter. Turn on your P3 and look directly down at the edge of the platter to see if it's moving in and out from the center spindle. Flip, repeat.

13. Believe it or not, the P3 sounds a tiny (but only a tiny) bit better depending on the way in which you plug it in. After a long listening session, so that your ears are really tuned in, unplug and reverse the plug. You may prefer one way over the other.

14. Place your P3 on something light and rigid like the $15 Ikea Lack table. If possible, place that table next to a load-bearing or outside wall (but not directly next to the wall -- give it an inch or two). Glass is the worst. Mushy things like vibrapods and big, massive supports like granite or maple butcher block are also horrid for Regas, as they "suck the life out" of the music.

And finally - not related to sound, but for safety you should -- if possible -- use your fingers to attach the cartridge clips to the cartridge, rather than needle nose or tweezers, which can damage cartridge clips.

Enjoy!
Hukk

 

Don't even waste your time trying to get the wally tractor. Even if you manage to get him on the phone and he takes your money, you could be joining the long line of people that he has never delivered the product to!

Go to Acoustic Sounds and get their stuff. It works AND they have it in stock so that you can get your turntable going RIGHT NOW.

By chance if you get stuck, talk to Clark who is an analog genius. Five minutes and he'll have you rolling.

Less time screwing around, more time listening to records.

That's the way you want to roll!

 

Thanks! I like those settings on my P3/10x5 combo.

 

Yup!

-Hukk

 

Thanks for posting your impressions. The Dyna is on my shortlist, and you might have moved it up a notch or two. Let us know what it does when you get more hours in on it.

 

Me too. Finally got around to re-setting up the cartridge based on Hukk's recommendations. More action up top this way.

 

Looks like I spoke too soon

Today I put on the test record to see how the new settings did, and it isn't pretty. I re-checked everything that I did last night and I have the overhang and alignment set perfect for the Baerwald protractor. But now the bias is way off (right channel distortion) and moving the slider on the Rega arm will not improve it. It doesn't just show up listening to the test record. The tonearm pulls outward when in the area between tracks. I also get the distortion on the tracking tests. This is at about 1.95 tracking weight.

Hukk, if you read this, any idea what is wrong?

For now, I am going to go back to the Stevenson alignment, which sounds fine, because I can be sure my settings are right and everything is dialed in. I'll give the Baerwald another try if anybody can think of why it won't dial in correctly for me. Thanks.

 

Baerwald sounds better than Stevenson. I've tried both ways. Also if you look on the Vinyl Asylum, there is a mad scientist (actually he's a normal nice guy) who actually plotted out the distortion that he measured with each alignment. His graph clearly showed Baerwald as providing less overall distortion.

I've never had an anti-skate issue with a Rega or a 10x5... trying to think what could have been responsible. Are you measuring tracking weight with the Rega tonearm wheel or with a scale?

 

Here's the distortion graphs I mentioned.

You are looking for the area under the red line. More area under the red line equals higher distortion.

http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.mpl...ghlight=elison+baerwald+stevenson&r=&session=

 

Hukk, thanks very much for your response. I have turned the dial to the maximum to disable it, and am using the Shure gauge with the counterweight to set VTF.

I have reset the cartridge using Stevenson again, and the tonearm is still pulling outward between tracks on the test record. Maybe it is supposed to do that. I can't remember. But the bias tests much better now. I am able to make adjustments on the bias slide that I can hear while playing. I couldn't improve the bias at all with Baerwald.

P.S. Thanks for the link to the graphs.

 

Set-up your arm as it should be according to the manual. The Rega tracking force scale is very accurate. You will not find it to vary. Don't try silly stuff you read others doing, it doesn't work as well.

You will find Baerwald alignment to work better across the record and Stevenson to reduce inner groove distortion a bit. Both schemes work fine if they are correctly implemented. You need to have an accurate protractor, some mechanical skills, and good eyes, as well as patience, to do it properly. If you lack any of those, get some help. I could tell by the photos which you posted earlier that the original set-up was way off but I didn't have the heart to break it to you. Now that the cat is outta the bag...

Anti-skating should be set very near the tracking force when it is done correctly. You need to rebalance the arm after you adjust the cartridge azimuth for a true zero reference. Be sure that your protractor is correct; don't rely on garbage downloaded and printed unless you can verify it. Some of those are dreadfully hard to read even if they scale properly. I have one that is easy to read and measure for accuracy if you want to try it, I'll give you the link by PM. It also includes other free goodies.
-Bill

 

Out of curiosity, what did you see in the photos that led to this conclusion?

 

You mean like Michael Fremer?

Bill, I find you to be very condescending. Please take your expertise elsewhere. Thanks.